(Home) Suspension

Could anyone kindly advise please? Do any of the Hi-Ace models have the same suspension as the Town/Masterace, ie, front torsion bar & rear coil springs ? My reason for asking is that I am still working on improving the suspension and, shortly, when I strip the suspension for a thorough inspection, I may re-fit any (probably many) worn rubber mountings with an improved polyurethane type. There are sets made for the Hi-Ace but, as far as I know, none for the Townace.

- (#5676) John Davis, 29 Sep 02

Similar but different, John. Same goes for HiLux. Bushes etc may be interchangeable, though. Note the relevant part nos on the cd, then enter them into "part nos application to model", and see what else uses them.
- (#5677) david miller, 30 Sep 02

Thanks David. Yes, the CD comparison feature will be the way to go. I should have thought of that

- (#5678) John Davis, 30 Sep 02


Hi all, Great site, as a new townie we have found this site very usefull.
As our townace( Royal lounge 1991 ) was very bumpy and a hard ride we adjusted the front suspension as indicated in the main site. The ride is much better now, no more hard bumps, but i am concerned that the rear of the van seems to have lowered a bit, can anyone tell me if this is normal pls.
many thanks Dave

- (#7615) Dave & Denise, 12 Mar 03

The rear will look lower in comparison.
A set of rubber spring assistors can help balance the rearup...
Dave Lipscombe? Ex of QUB?

- (#7616) david miller, 12 Mar 03

QUB ? no afraid not.
Thanks for the reply, are the spring assistors easy to buy and can fit them myself?

PS. i will be fitting a tow bar for a folding camper.
Dave

- (#7617) Dave, 12 Mar 03

Yes, they're just a rubber ring that goes in between two coils of each spring. Caravan and towing places sell them.

- (#7618) david miller, 12 Mar 03

the rear suspension bags and bumps quite loud. It has TEMS. is it adjustable or will the shock absorbers have to be replaces they cost £217+vat each or do you forget the TEMS and fit ordinary shocks.

- (#7747) Peter Elliott, 18 Mar 03


Hi

Does anybody now what the tracking/camber/wheel- alignment should be on my 91 Master Ace Surf.
It drifts slightly to the left when it should be going in a straight line.
I've owned it three years and it's never been checked.
- (#8044) Chris Adams, 11 Apr 03 4:22

All tracking details are listed on AceAnswers. The specs are different for 2WD and 4WD but both should be listed

- (#8045) Ian Dunse, 11 Apr 03 5:16


Recently, I posted a note about trying to improve the ride on my 4WD Masterace and, hopefully, to get rid of that shock through the front suspension when passing over even the smallest bump in the road. Many people have commented on the reasons for the fairly hard ride and I have tried to incorporate all of the suggestions in my recent suspension overhaul.
With the torsion bars fully unloaded, I found no wear in either the top or bottom,inner wishbone bushes or outer swivels and, in fact, could find no "slack" anywhere in these assemblies which might give the "thump" often felt when passing over any small obstruction (rumble strips) in the road. I have converted the four plugged points, on the inner wishbone pivots, to remote, piped, grease nipples, so that they can be lubricated from time to time.
The front anti roll bar bushes were slightly worn and I have replaced/modified these. With careful adjustment of the tyre pressures,and some new grease into the nipples, I think that the ride is improved but, only slightly and, I am beginning to think that the less than perfect ride is something us owners have to live with. One thing though does puzzle me. The "ride height" measurement, ie, from the ground to the centre of the bottom wishbone swivel pin, is mentioned as 252 mm. In order to achieve this measurement, I would have to adjust the torsion bar rear mountings up to a very hard setting. I tried this but, the ride was so hard (with just the driver in the car) that I have fairly drastically reduced this measurement, to around 220 mm, to get back to an acceptable comfort level.
Could anyone comment or, better still, check their ride height measurement to see if this factory setting does, in fact remain after some years use. If I did keep the measurement at 252mm, the front of the vehicle is then far too, and unaturally, high.
I have also fitted a new cambelt and found that the crankshaft pulley bolt, though not loose, was certainly not as tight as it should have been and much below the torqued figure I tightened it to about 18 months ago. I have now fitted a simple locking device, ie, a short length of light box spanner, brazed to a thin flat plate. The box spanner section fits over the head of the pulley bolt and the thin plate is sandwiched between the main drive pulley and the power steering pump pulley which bolts onto it. With this plate drilled, it is locked in position by the p/s pump pulley bolts and ensures that the crankshaft pulley bolt cannot unwind. With the mayhem, and cost, which results from a detached pulley, I think that this is a very worthwhile modification to incorporate whenever anyone replaces their cambelt or has the main pulley off to replace the aircon belt or carry out other work

- (#8453) John Davis, 15 May 03 4:54

John,
Your fix sounds like a great idea.( I've had 2 replacement pulleys only 5000m between them) Any ideas why the bolt is not at the original torque ?
Does this mean that overtorque ( with caution )is recommended ?

- (#8537) stephen judge, 15 May 03 16:25

The suspension on these will never be as good as a conventional sedan. This is because of the seating position. As you are right over the wheel the full impact of any bump is transferred to you, rather than being reduced by a 'level factor' - the distance you are behind the wheel.

I for one don't find it too much of a problem.
Have you driven another Ace to compare? Or another cab forward van - these are MUCH better than some.

There are many advantages to this design, but there are some drawbacks. The question is, assuming there is nothing wrong with your van, are the advantages worth more than the disadvantages for you?

Dave.

- (#8538) DaveW, 15 May 03 22:05

Stephen. You obviously know the cost of your two pulley disasters and, for the limited number of Town/Masteraces about, the frequency of failure is, in my opinion, alarming. My view is that it is all to do with the mass/weight of these pulleys. A drive pulley becoming detached, on a convential car, is almost unheard of but, the torque/impact effect, on the pulley bolt, on start up, with our vehicles, is tremendous and, only the minutest bit of slack in the keyway, alows this torque to be transferred to the bolt and, over time, helps it to unwind. With a clockwise rotating shaft, and a right hand threaded bolt, it is essential that the bolt be tight but, my view is that "over torquing" is a bit risky. If a left hand threaded bolt were fitted, the start up torque would probably make the bolt impossible to remove or, possibly, shear off. Who am I to criticise the Toyota designer but, I feel that our pulley setup, and it's mass, like some industrial engines, requires some sort of locking device on the bolt and that's why I fitted one to my pulley.
These pulley bolts should be checked very frequently and, when fitting the pulley, the key and it's keyway must be perfect.
Dave. Thanks for your comments re the "ride". Yes, I can see that the location, of the driver's postion, does not benefit from the "level factor" and, on reflection, rear passengers have often commented on how comfortable the vehicle is in the back. Perhaps, with my advancing years, I am getting too fussy.

- (#8539) John Davis, 16 May 03 2:21

Don't put yourself down John. I'm so fed up with the crap ride to work and back every day, I've bought myself another car just for that purpose. Everyone I give a lift to comments on the "bread van" ride over the typical roads to be found in our Towns and Cities. However, the Townace comes into its own on long runs and especially motorways where I find the journey most pleasurable (wife, kid and dog permitting). In fact I think the name "Townace" is a poor description and "AceCruiser" might be more appropriate.

Looking forward to the cruise down the M42/M5 tomorrow to the Jam.

- (#8540) Ian Dunse, 16 May 03 3:41

Ian,

Can't help jumping in there. When I bought the townie, me and wife were tempted of getting rid of either the Camry and/or the Corolla (respectively) but, on a second thought we decided against it, and keep them for the day to day fight-your-way-on-grumpy-roads. No question, the townie is unrivaled for anything over 100KM or 6+ daydreaming souls .
"AceCruiser"? not bad, but "ClanAce" (with a Japanese accent) sounds better, reason
wife and five kids :>)

Happy Jam

- (#8541) Manecas, 16 May 03 9:53

I note how my hiace gets a thump at the front but the rear end glides over bumps comfortably
It was supplied fitted with cheap van tyres and as they are new they will have to stay a while
Tyre choice can make a huge difference - I remember 20 yrs ago I used to drive a vw lt van (with van tyres)
The employer later put standard michelins on.It was hard to believe at the time that tyres could make such a difference - the ride became very car like and soft soaking up the bumps.

I find that now I just drive slower round town etc. watching out for small bumps - (the bigger ones requiring drastic manouvers!) but as we all know if we drive quickly all the other traffic only catches us up at the next lights or roadworks - so whats the point.
I am now quite happy to pootle about taking in the sights knowing I'll get there just as quick as most (traffic) - and my young son loves the bumps!

Anyway thats why I ditched my car - it was so sophisticated and smooth (bland) you barely knew you were driving.
As someone who likes driving I think its important to KNOW THAT YOU ARE DRIVING - the odd bump and thump from the front suspension does at least make for a driving experience and the vehicle always makes for an interesting trip - all part of the charm and character I think
As long as everthing operates as it should its there to be enjoyed
It would I agree be nice to eliminate it - but if it won't go away might as well enjoy it!
Chris
- (#8542) chris turner, 16 May 03 17:38

Have you considered additional soundproofing to muffle the bumps?
I used a little acoustic felt which certainly reduced engine/exhaust noise
There also seem to be a selection of sound absorbsion type sticky mats available - wondered if judicious use especially around suspension mount points may help?
Try looking at
http://www.noisekiller.co.uk/soundproofing4.htm
Their 'lead sandwich' sounds interesting.......
Not butty shop material though!
Chris
- (#8543) chris turner, 17 May 03 17:17

Thanks Chris. No,I had not considered additional soundproofing but, after looking at the site which you mention, some ideas do come to mind. Although the noise within my vehicle is not too bad, some extra absorption type material might muffle the shocks a little bit. As it happens, there is a manufacturer of this type of material, not far from where I live. Perhaps I will have a look in their "offcuts" skip.

- (#8544) John Davis, 18 May 03 5:37

Hi - it took me a little while to sort out tyre pressures on my newly-acquired 1989 Townace - after reading some of the wonderfully valuable advice on here I settled on about 40psi front and rear. Much less makes the handling a bit too vague, and more gives me an unacceptably hard ride. What are you running your front tyres at?

Cheers

- (#8745) Arthur, 23 May 03 0:30

I have the Continental Vanco 185/80 tyres which do give a much better ride. I run them at 33/35 and find that this is the optimum pressure, ie, a compromise between a slightly hard ride and slightly vague handling. The standard tyres are recommended to run at approx 2.3 bar, ie, 33/34 psi. I did experiment with a much higher pressure (40 psi, when I had the 185/70 profile tyres but found the ride much too harsh.

- (#8746) John Davis, 23 May 03 11:56

could any one tell me what back springs would fit a toyota master ace surf as will the town ace fit or any other van or car

i need to know as soon as poss for m.o.t.
thanks
pat

- (#8908) pat, 3 Jun 03 10:26